Not quite sure what to make of the lack of love for Chinchikurin here. I am still new, but have enjoyed reading the various reviews so far–especially the @Chowseeker1999 Fried Chicken rundown.
Hiroshima Okonomiyaki =/= Osaka Okonomiyaki
For those of you that have not yet had a chance to check out Chinchikurin, perhaps due to the negative reviews here (@bulavinaka) , I encourage you to go try it for yourself.
This is a rare opportunity in the US. This is hiroshima-style okonomiyaki being dished out by (mostly) Hiroshima natives.
If one of these Hiroshima natives that came here from Hiroshima to start Chinchikurin makes your okonomiyaki, rest assured that the way it is served is the way it is meant to be eaten (if you order “crispy”)*.
*Caveat: mistakes happen (rarely).
He has been making okonomiyaki for more than 15 years.
Please do not judge Hiroshima-style okonomiyaki against Osaka-style okonomiyaki. In the beer world, that would be to commit the same sin as to judge a lager against the style of an ale.
The noodles are supposed to be a bit hard! That is what makes it delicious. You get a bit of fried noodle component.
The noodles are yakisoba noodles. They are not supposed to be thin. They are a bit meaty. That’s what makes them delicious.
Modan-yaki and Hiroshima-yaki are different styles.
All I am saying is: give them a shot. If you don’t like it, you don’t like Hiroshima-style okonomiyaki.
My roots are in Hiroshima. My mom used to make Hiroshima-style oko pretty regularly. I’ve eaten a good handful of different iterations of oko in Hiroshima as well, but only as recent as 2012.
Chinchikurin’s oko is definitely Hiroshima-style oko. My issue with the noodles is not the girth of the noodles - that’s fine - (Hassho and Okonomiyaki Lopez use thinner noodles if I recall (as did my mom)). The noodles are too Al dente to the point of seeming uncooked to me. They boiling baskets are on a spring-loaded lever that acts as a timer. If those noodles are at the preferred doneness, I’m out.
Everything else is fine (the ikaten is not my bag - never had it on oko in Hiroshima myself - I do like the jalapeños that Lopez-san offers). I prefer Hiroshima-style oko to Kansai. My gripes are (I guess) stylistic. I like Doya Doya’s Kansai oko better than Chinchikurin’s Hiroshima-style oko. Shrug…
I’ve actually eaten quite a bit of Hiroshima okonomiyaki. IN Hiroshima. I agree with you - It is absolutely a different style than Osaka okonomiyaki. The noodles are supposed to have more ‘Q’.
Having said that, I have to agree with @bulavinaka on the point that the noodles at Chinchikurin (at least on the 2 visits I’ve gone) were too hard, even for the okonomiyaki-style that I recalled enjoying in Hiroshima. (Kenji-san was not my chef on either of my visits)
I will try and go back when Kenji-san is cooking that day…
Bula, I grew up with Hiroshima-style okonomiyaki too, since my mom’s from Yamaguchi-ken, a neighboring prefecture to Hiroshima. Funny coincidence that our families are from the same general region.
Back to okonomiyaki, I haven’t tried Chinchikurin yet, but Doya Doya is my go-to. I’m still on the fence about trying Chinchikurin though. Maybe I’ll give it a bit.
Right on. I may be a bit biased. I loved Chinchikurin when I tried it in Tokyo. That may be why I am so happy to have it here in LA. I think they are pretty well replicating the okonomiyaki that I had at two of Shinbashi locations.
I enjoy the crispiness of the noodles. However, I thought it came more from frying on the teppan than being undercooked.
I have only tried Doya Doya once and was not around for Gaja.
Note on ikaten: I have not had it in the okonomiyaki. But, being one of Hiroshima’s famous snack foods, I can understand why Chinchikurin wants to highlight it. I’ll check it out next time.
I think we can all agree that, while there’s a basic “formula” for okonomiyaki, if there was ever a dish that has no rules after the basics, this is the dish.
I love oysters, but on okonomiyaki? Gag! I know that’s sacrilege in Hiroshima, considering how much these bi-valves are cherished in this prefecture. But that is the beauty of this dish. Even though I choose NOT to add oysters, no food cops are going to bust me.
I’m sure you know what I’m about to lay out here - just giving some extra info for others in general. Every okonomiyaki house that takes pride in their food has their own style and twists - this is what draws their respective fan bases. Chinchikurin’s style is obviously loved by many - otherwise, they wouldn’t have achieved such success. Kenji-san was there (along with another chef -older and shorter) so I assume I got what was their standard. I guess I just don’t prefer it.
Lopez-san told me that he was under the direct tutelage of Hassho’s Ogawa sensei for his relatively quick apprenticeship before he and his wife opened their own shop. Because of this lineage, it’s no surprise that his style is very similar to Ogawa sensei 's.
The sourcing in Japan is crazy eccentric compared to here. Hassho requests all of their eggs be double-yolk - and like magic (to us), Hassho gets this “special” request fulfilled. The larger proportion of yolk to white adds an extra richness and flavor to their oko. In deference to Ogawa sensei, Lopez san does the same - double-yolk eggs. And while Lopez san has his own signature add-ons and menu items, his basic style is pulled from the Hassho game book.
Hiroshima is sort of off the grid (compared to Tokyo, Osaka and Kyoto, and now to a lesser degree Hokkaido). So recent versions of local specialties are going to be somewhat rare. I don’t know where chinchikurin falls in the 1-10 scale in Hiroshima, but I just can’t get past the noodles. If they had a further degree of doneness, maybe I’d like it a lot more. Just my .02…
Thanks for the thoughts. I’ve had Hiroshima-style Okonomiyaki as well, and as @bulavinaka and @J_L are saying, I just find it too al dente (like it’s just hard / undercooked). Maybe some people like it that way, but it’s off-putting.
I only listed Doya Doya here because sadly in L.A. we’ve lost other Oko specialists. These are our last 2 standing.
I think the idea is to eat the grilled oysters separately. One would find it almost impossible to balance an oyster on top of a piece of okonomiyaki and fit the whole thing in their mouth.[quote=“bulavinaka, post:26, topic:5243”]
I’m sure you know what I’m about to lay out here - just giving some extra info for others in general.
[/quote]
As was the case with my original post. I wanted to offer a counter opinion to the one that had already been expressed. And @Chowseeker1999 (as much knowledge as he/she has) seemed to be combining the two.
The double yolks thing is interesting. We got a carton of eggs the other day and they were all doubles! Kind of off-putting (even if it is achieved naturally)
About the noodles: why not just ask for softer noodles on your next visit? I am sure they would be willing to accomodate this. BTW, the shorter older guy is the company founder, Kawakami-san.
Kintai Bridge in Iwakuni! Lots of immigrants from this region of Japan came here in the early 20th century because of a wide spread famine.
Obviously, many came from this region post-WWII because of the lack of almost everything resulting from the two A-bombs compounding the other deleterious effects of the war. Lots of kibei returned as well - many yearned to return long before the war ended.
As you know, the two styles of okonomiyaki are apples & oranges. So judging these two examples might only confirm one’s preferences. Like me, you just might betray your roots. If I were to try Chinchikurin again, I’d try asking as politely as possible if they could boil the noodles longer. And if they did so, I’d be interested to see if this were more to my liking.
I don’t think you even have to get on your knees to ask for softer noodles. I believe it is built into their menu. Each okonomiyaki is offered “soft” or “crispy”.
If you previously went and ordered “soft” but did not like it, then you may have to get on the floor…
I once got a carton of double yolk eggs from a Safeway and was astounded until a coworker with relatives in the egg business up in Petaluma clued me in. Some
Producers will pull double yolk eggs off to the side for special orders like you just mentioned.
Finding such a carton in a grocery store is usually an indication of a line worker getting bored. I like the thought of this.
Do you know much about okonomiyaki, the Japanese so-called savory pancake? If not you can find a keen explainer right this way at Food Talk Central, along with a comparison between one Sawtelle Japantown option and another in the South Bay."
Found myself in Torrance today, and so I found my way to Doya Doya.
It was my first time having okonomiyaki, and it’s quite the experience for a first timer, I’d say. In a great way. The sizzling UFO is placed in front of you, and the burning sauce creates an intoxicating aroma. I ordered the regular Mix Special (pork / calamari / shrimp) on the recommendation of the server who sweetly showed me the mayo, seaweed and bonito flake topper options. (Jokes on her though - I had already watched the table next to me prepare theirs, so I was already a pro by this point.)
My original fears of over-saucing luckily weren’t founded. It turned out to be a good amount in tandem with the thick pancake mix. Overall, I really liked it. Interesting textures throughout, including the parts of the pancake that you leave to the end and get a bit extra char from the sizzle after shock.
That layer mix guide that @Chowseeker1999 posted is super helpful because I probably wouldn’t have been able to identify many of the individual in a line-up. But I’m a simpleton. But! a simpleton who had a tasty lunch.
The layer mix guide that @Chowseeker1999 provided applies to Hiroshima-style okonomiyaki only, not Osaka-style. Even if you got the one with noodles, Modan-yaki (born in Kobe [Wikipedia]).
In the most basic terms: Osaka-style is a mixed batter savory pancake. Hiroshima-yaki is a layered noodle-centric dish–I would not even call it a pancake as the only batter (in most cases) is a thin layer that does not incorporate the other ingredients.
Wow, you’ve heard of the Kintai-kyo?! Since my mom’s from Iwakuni, we used to go on the cormorant fishing river cruises under the bridge during summer vacations. I always felt sorry for the birds that had to catch the fish.
Thanks for the explanation about Japanese immigration. For those that aren’t familiar with the term kibei, they are American-born-Japanese individuals who were educated in Japan and returned to America after the conclusion of their studies.
I appreciate the tip about asking for softer noodles at Chinchikurin. Well, I think a taste test is in order soon, but I’m also itching to try making my own. I used to whip up my own when I was a teen, but it’s been eons since I last made a batch.
My uncle’s business partner (great great guy) showed me around some of Japan’s memorable and significant places in Japan. Kintai-kyo was one the the must-sees. He explained the design and purpose of this bridge, as well as the cormorants and ayu. It was a fascinating visit (and dinner!).
@Starchtrade has great insight and suggestions. At the same time, getting a grill-side seat and getting Kenji-san’s insights would be ideal.
Maybe some people like it that way, but it’s off-putting.
If I were to try Chinchikurin again, I’d try asking as politely as possible if they could boil the noodles longer. And if they did so, I’d be interested to see if this were more to my liking.