you can only see it as passive aggressive if you don’t know (willfully or ignorantly) the fundamental elements that are the components of the definition of the term.
basically, you can “see” anything you want, given enough imagination.
Hmm. Anyone can “see” whatever they want. It’s the way people experience life. The ongoing question in threads like these is whether people can step back far enough to “see” someone else’s point of view.
Tact?
A moderator printing his email to the member and then setting up a new link dedicated to his departure where the other members can debate the non-food-related behavior and motivations of that member seems more like an unfortunate continuation of the cyber bullying that has led to Kevin’s departure. I am reminded of @robert and his branding of another member as “a dick” and then openly discussing that with others. Forget passive aggressive. This is actual aggression and cyber bullying.
BTW so many want to pile on Kevin publicly here but nobody has the transparency to admit to kvetching about him behind his back.
Crickets…
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Interesting. I did not see Ipse’s letter or this discussion as such but perhaps there are elements.
Similarly, I suppose cyber bullying is exactly what those who disliked the profanity but do not wish to self-identify, are trying to avoid…
Being both respectful of others AND honest to yourself in an online community can be a challenge.
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The introspection is appreciated. My feeling is what Kevin did wasn’t cyber bullying because it wasn’t directed at anyone specifically. For example @robert called a member a dick on his home page and said “fuck him” and other nice things about him publicly; this is different from using the words fuck and dick generally. Big concern here is that the most egregious and targeted behavior this site has seen has been from the moderators not the peanut gallery. One bully turns into a whole pack of bullies with that leadership.
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maybe someone else’s “point of view” would include wishing not to be labeled with a psychological disorder when the label is clearly not applicable.
it would seem to me that “TACT” would include restraining yourself from indulging in such labeling altogether, but ESPECIALLY restrain yourself from such MISLABELING.
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I don’t understand why @kevin says “fuck” all the time and does other odd things in casual posts, but since his longer reviews are written in a completely different style it’s clearly a choice, and he contributes a lot to the board. Maybe more than all the “fuck”-haters who are bothered by his schtick.
People who don’t like to see “fuck” or any other word can install WebCensor to hide it.
I don’t know where people live that they can be so sensitive about language. Around here high school students sound like dialog from “The Last Detail.”
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I miss kevin, too. I think @ipsedixit did what he had to do as a moderator (given that he had received complaints) and handled it well. I wish @kevin hadn’t decided to fuck off as a result, but it is his prerogative. I get that the profanity is a little over the top but I personally find it funny and wish we had a bit more of a “live and let live” attitude around here to posters’ styles of writing.
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@ipsedixit’s caving to a minority lynch mob and then publicizing it was a mistake as far as the site’s ultimate credibility and success. It’s not a safe place except for the chosen few that are neither tolerant nor transparent. The ranks have thinned considerably in the last month or so and they are continuing to thin. But this is the apparent want of the actual powers that be. Much lost promise here and a bigger failure than chowhound ultimately. At least there the moderators took untoward actions in private.
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This is BS. I’m noticing some new names and posters come up that weren’t around before.
This is a public community site not Kevin’s site. Of course it would be great to him and the likes of JJ around but if they choose to leave instead of responding to constructive criticism, what can you do? Certainly no one is going to be begging anyone to stay against their wishes.
It’s not anything like CH. The moderation is fair and transparent. If ipse hadn’t posted the email there would be a lot of second guessing and insinuations of what was really said and the good inspector here (JJ is that you?) would be trying to burn ipse for being harsher in the email than he actually was.
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But sounds like you who act like it’s your site with your moderator and your rules, and looks like you’ve won out, pyrrhically of course.
Kevin didn’t break any actual rules. JJ got flat out smeared and left for roadkill. And I can’t even count the number of other voices also scared away.
Enjoy your site and your rules. You don’t want an actual community.
Anyone with the courage to at least own up to complaining to the moderator? Doubt it. Actual transparency isn’t for cowards.
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I signed onto Discourse early on . There was maybe six people .I was glad to see this site where it wasn’t moderated to shit like CH . Kevin came right after that . His first post was " Testing the fuck meter " . He made you aware of his language . He is a superb writer and a culinary savant . I enjoyed reading his descriptions of LA eateries . His Ode to Tanas writing was one of a kind .Superb . I will sorely miss his wit . You could have edited his language if it was a problem for you . If you didn’t like it there was the other site that came right after .
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What are we debating here? Kevin’s freedom to drop F bombs? His freedom to repeatedly troll for where to find prostitutes at Mastros? At what point do you set boundaries? Those people defending his F bomb use, do you also defend his Mastro’s prostitute threads? Why object to one but not the other? And for the record, I find one annoying and one inappropriate but both very much intentional.
The fact is no one banned Kevin. Kevin went radio silent because someone asked nicely “Would it be possible if you didn’t curse so much?”
If you play your music too loud and disturb your neighbors is it reasonable to be asked to turn down your music? Most people would probably say yes and turn down the music.
No one asked you to stop listening to music. But if your response is to stop listening to music instead of turning down the music, that is your choice to respond in that all or nothing manner.
But then don’t try to twist things and say your music was taken from you. Because it wasn’t.
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Either would be OK with me.
But I do think you may have misconstrued the prostitution musings.
Prurient interest, sure, but I don’t think trolling.
I know many people - both on chowhound and in conversation - who are not soliciting prostitutes yet still find that aspect of the clientele at the upstairs bar at Mastro BH well worthy of discussion. It is interesting to me, even though I stick to the printed menu. I don’t find it pervy anymore than I would find discussing the architecture at Redbird to be a religious discussion because it was once a monastery. To me this is a website for discussing the many aspects of food and restaurants, and, for better or worse, that is an aspect of that restaurant.
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There’s no software I can use to filter out my neighbors’ loud music, so it’s a reasonable complaint (especially since in my town it’s illegal to play music so loud that your neighbors can hear it inside).
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I seem to have forgotten (1 month after most recent thread), can someone tell me where to find…
I call that trolling.
I don’t consider prostitution the same as architecture at Redbird. One topic would garner you accolades if you discussed it in front of a 4rd grade classroom the other…well you probably wouldn’t would you?
Bose noise cancelling headphones or earplugs would be the appropriate analogy to your software filter.
Why make it illegal to play loud music when you can just have people use ear plugs or noise cancelling headphones?
I suppose we will have to agree to disagree on this one. I think the scenery at both places merits discussion here - where 4th graders are in short supply (particularly now that kevin has left 
.) And if something bothered me, I would ignore it, rather than argue for it to change, or for it to be censored. You, of course, are completely entitled to feel differently.
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Reading in a web browser is a private experience. If the word “fuck” bothers you to the extent that you’re going to complain about it, why not install WebCensor and be done with it?
The bottom line for me is that I find @kevin writing “fuck” all the time a little weird, but I find people who get so upset about it that they expect someone to censor him for their benefit very weird.
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Just to be clear, I’m not sure anyone argued for it to be censored.
And in case you’re wondering, my only exchange to Ipse was in public asking the mods to lock the “I forgot where to find the eye candy at Mastro’s” thread because it was just trolling for more prostitute discussion because he didn’t really “forget” did he?
See my response to Bob. It wasn’t me. But I do object to the attempted public shaming by those who object to what I think was a reasonable request by Ipse.
My response to Kevin has for the most part been to ignore and that’s the way I’ve approached it for the past few years.
Regarding your why not just install webcensor, can you vouch that the software and the download sites don’t contain malware? You could just as well ask why not just use 50% less "fucks’ and punctuation. There’s two sides to every argument and it’s not all or nothing.